Author Topic: What thread to use?  (Read 2170 times)

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draaven

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What thread to use?
« on: June 02, 2015, 05:55:19 PM »
Hey guys,

I have done a lot of research on this (hours and hours), and I am still having problems. What thread would you recommend for two different applications:

1.  1000d Cordura and maybe 500d cordura that will be exposed to the sun, and basically be outdoors almost all the time? I am worried about deterioration and fading of the thread. I would hate to make an OD Green product and the thread end up turning white, because it is left outdoors all the time.

2. Same question for polypropylene webbing. The webbing will be box x stitched (bartacked) to itself. It will be outdoors almost 100% of the time. I know the webbing itself shouldn't fade, but again, I would hate to have black webbing with faded thread everywhere.

I was planning on using A&E Tex 70 Bonded Nylon for the Cordura gear, but again, it will be outside most of the time. I am not sure at all on the polypro webbing thread at this point.

Any ideas?

Thanks!


SunriseTacticalGear

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Re: What thread to use?
« Reply #1 on: June 02, 2015, 09:16:48 PM »
A couple of ways to look at this. If you use nylon thread for nylon fabric they may fade at the same rate.
For items requiring structural strength I would use polyester thread, with the thought that the stitches will outlast the fabric and people won't say "your stitches failed".
Since I don't know what product you are building I'm making some generalizations and assuming high UV exposure, more than most Military gear.
Scott
« Last Edit: June 03, 2015, 03:20:46 PM by SunriseTacticalGear »

draaven

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Re: What thread to use?
« Reply #2 on: June 03, 2015, 09:37:52 AM »
A couple of ways to look at this. If you use nylon thread for nylon fabric they may fade at the same rate.
For items requiring structural strength I would use polyester thread, with the thought that the stitches will outlast the fabric and people won't say "your stitches failed".
Since I don't know what product you are building I'm making some generalizations.
Scott

Thanks for the input. I think I am going to stick with the nylon thread for the cordura stuff considering tac gear uses it. For the webbing, I am looking into some polyester options.

Thanks!

Fouinard

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Re: What thread to use?
« Reply #3 on: June 03, 2015, 10:05:50 AM »
I use only nylon atm, but I always read everywhere that nylon thread is for indoor and poly thread for outdoor use cause it's less damaged by UV rays... Knowing that, why everybody's using nylon instead of poly thread? Because of the price? Maybe the damages caused by UVs appears only after a very long period of time and it's irrelevant? Something else...

draaven

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Re: What thread to use?
« Reply #4 on: June 03, 2015, 11:14:15 AM »
I use only nylon atm, but I always read everywhere that nylon thread is for indoor and poly thread for outdoor use cause it's less damaged by UV rays... Knowing that, why everybody's using nylon instead of poly thread? Because of the price? Maybe the damages caused by UVs appears only after a very long period of time and it's irrelevant? Something else...

Yeah, that's the thing I'm trying to figure out. If the nylon is good for 5 years, then that's great, but if it bleaches and fails after one year in the sun, then that's not great. From what I keep researching, I will probably use the poly thread for the polypro webbing, since it will be outside 75% of the time. As far as tac gear, I'll just use what 99% of everyone else uses which is the nylon.

Stepan1983

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Re: What thread to use?
« Reply #5 on: June 03, 2015, 01:34:37 PM »
Nylon is few times stronger than polyester in terms of abrasion. Tactical gear is usually damaged by abrasion, not torn.

By the way, there are aerosoles and liquids for UV protection. For example NikWax has this thing for gear and tents, it repels the water and helps to protect from UV

Disturbed

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Re: What thread to use?
« Reply #6 on: June 03, 2015, 03:11:27 PM »
Poly or Polycotton thread is used in applications like trampolines, tents etc where it is going to be exposed to UV all day every day for extended periods (weeks to months).  Polycotton is also used a lot in canvas packs for the reason the thread will swell slightly when wet as the fibres in the canvas do also improving water resistance.

Nylon is stronger and handles rough use better hence why is the gold standard in tactical gear and load bearing restraints.

TwoWayTrauma

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Re: What thread to use?
« Reply #7 on: June 05, 2015, 12:16:21 AM »
There are a few different unit systems for categorizing thread size.  Unfortunately, they are not very standardized, so they don't convert easily.  Here is a video that explains that basic problem: 


I stick to mil-spec nylon bonded nylon thread that is made in the USA.  The minimum I use on anything is size 69.  This is also good, because it can also be used on most household machines with a little TLC.  For most of my gear I use size 92.  For belts that I know will take serious abuse, I use size 138.  For leather, I use size 207 because it's just about the biggest thread my machine can handle while using the same thread from the spool and bobbin at the same time.  I mainly use it because it is larger diameter and less likely to cut through leather because it isn't as thin.  Towards the bottom of this page, you can see a reference chart (http://www.thethreadexchange.com/miva/merchant.mvc?Screen=CTGY&Category_Code=nylon-thread-information)

Nylon isn't the most ideal material for webbing or thread, but it's what the government specifies in a lot of requests for proposals (RFPs). 

Here is a crude but quick chart that shows the properties of several synthetic fabrics (https://www.strapworks.com/Articles.asp?ID=144).  It is pertaining to webbing, but the information can easily be converted to the properties of the thread the webbing is made from.  You can wikipedia the melting temps of different materials, but a 480ish F melting temp is pretty decent for an inexpensive fabric like polyester. 

For hand sewn leather stuff, I use braided was nylon cord, but I digress...

Hit me up with any questions.

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essal

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Re: What thread to use?
« Reply #8 on: June 05, 2015, 05:06:12 PM »
Here is the mil-spec for thread: http://everyspec.com/COMML_ITEM_DESC/A-A-59000_A-A-59999/A-A-59826_14817/
It uses (true)Tex for weight measurement, so I'd say that's the only correct way to refer to thread size/weight. So what we refer to as 69 has a Tex betwen 68 and 70, and it's commonly referred to by most companies as a Tex 70 thread. If you order Tex 70, 69 bonded nylon and E size thread from the same company you'll get the same product.

Tex is 1000 meters of finish thread in grams.
Nora Tactical
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