Author Topic: Different backpack strap mounting options  (Read 3253 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Fouinard

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 172
  • Forum creeper
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 90
  • Likes Given: 165
Different backpack strap mounting options
« on: August 25, 2016, 11:17:42 AM »
Hi,

There are several ways I can think of when it comes to strap mouting (don't know if that's the correct term).

- Directly sewn at the top of the pack


- Sewn at the top of the pack with some webbing in-between


- Sewn lower on the backpanel with or without webbing in-between

I get that when you sew the straps lower on the backpanel you can use load lifters, webbing in-between are used to allow for more flexibility, and sometimes more adjustment when it's not fixed.

What are your thoughts on the different options available, in term of comfort or ease of design? (whether you are making it or using it)

Cheers!

mogensbeck

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 212
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 85
  • Likes Given: 12
Re: Different backpack strap mounting options
« Reply #1 on: August 25, 2016, 01:10:47 PM »
I dont know about the comfort and what is easier to make. But have seen many packs that have broken from the first model. The strap is to rigid and can not move so much so there is alot of stress on the stitches. Have had a few packs and repaired packs that have used this design. Never had any problem with Camelbak and TAD packs.

TangoDelta

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 48
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 8
  • Likes Given: 4
Re: Different backpack strap mounting options
« Reply #2 on: August 25, 2016, 02:43:00 PM »
I tried the second method but found it was too hard to consistently get right and neat with my limited skills, so I've been using the first for some 25 packs since. I sorta bartack the strap between backpanel and top of the pack, hung it from a stairwell and hung my 110 kilo ass from the strap, didn't move at all.

Longest one of my packs with this strap mounting has been in use is 3 years by a motorcycle-daily-commuter friend, no problems.

I think it's an easy method which produces nice results, plus I don't like the way straps with the second mounting option tend to twist while putting on.

Regards.
No gods or kings, only man.

essal

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 511
    • View Profile
    • Nora Tactical
  • Liked: 85
  • Likes Given: 45
Re: Different backpack strap mounting options
« Reply #3 on: August 25, 2016, 02:49:29 PM »
If I can't box-x it down, then I'm probably not using it. Load lifters are also required for any pack of a certain size.
Nora Tactical
Product Technician - Norrøna

BOgear

  • Global Moderator
  • Full Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 103
    • View Profile
    • BOgear Website
  • Liked: 43
  • Likes Given: 26
Re: Different backpack strap mounting options
« Reply #4 on: August 25, 2016, 04:34:00 PM »
What are your thoughts on the different options available, in term of comfort or ease of design? (whether you are making it or using it)

As with anything design related it comes down to:
What you want to achieve versus how much you (or your clients) are willing to pay.

There is no right or wrong answer to any backpack strap design consideration.

I have experimented with all the options you listed but found the right balance for us for cost effectiveness, comfort, and usability is the "attach slightly lower using webbing" method. In our designs this puts the straps at the right location on your back for the back length of the backpack. Given we are trying to move towards more "standardised" subcomponents, this also gives room for load lifters in the design at a later date if needed (or if the back pad length extends/lengthens allows us to add this feature). The webbing sewn into the seam, for us, is quick to sew and results in a fair amount of strength (more on this later). While the webbing itself allows a bit of "float" or twist such that the shoulder straps can rotate around different sized and shaped necks.

On paper, strength wise their should be no difference between sewing a strap directly into a seam versus using webbing into a seam. However as Mogensbeck notes, sewing straps directly into seams doesn't allow for twisting/movement and I have found instances of them tearing prematurely. In addition to this, depending on the design, if sewing foam into the seam it increases the thickness of the seam, meaning a bigger length of thread between lock stitches (vertically rather than measured across a traditional "stitch length"). This somewhat contributes to premature strap failure.

Of course the correct way to get around this is to not sew the foam into the seam, but rather to sew just fabric in - however getting back to my initial point of "what you want to achieve versus price willing to pay", sometimes removing foam in a certain section costs that little bit more (for instance in our spray lamination technique). And so the design then calls for adjustment to achieve the result required, which contributes to the price change.

Sorry, I love design, so ramble a bit, but the point is there is no right or wrong way. It all depends on your situation. What works for one may not work for another. BUT my belief, for our application, is in the webbing version for "float" and comfort. ;)

Dave
BOgear: http://www.bogear.com.au   |   Blog: http://www.bogear.com.au/blog   |   Instagram/Facebook/Twitter: @bogear

Bootcat

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 182
    • View Profile
    • Tiger Tailor
  • Liked: 21
  • Likes Given: 24
Re: Different backpack strap mounting options
« Reply #5 on: August 26, 2016, 05:45:30 AM »
Ergonomics-wise, mounting the straps about 2" below the shoulder line is better, with or without lifters. I like the webbing method the best for the reasons described above. It also allows to assemble the whole pack without shoulder straps dangling around, then add the straps, and last the stiffener (always a removable PEHD sheet in my use).
I would add that adding a curve to the top 1/3 of the side walls (as seen from the side), said curve putting the top seam about 1" closer to the back (i.e. the back wall now mimics the curvature of the shoulder blades), allows for cleaner tensioning of the fabric when the pack is worn, and the load lifters are less important. If you look for it you will find this curve on some good packs (Arcteryx and Karrimor SF among others).
Also, straps work better when the back length is well suited to the user. I often see short packs sitting on the users belt and the shoulder straps don't curve correctly.

Fouinard

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 172
  • Forum creeper
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 90
  • Likes Given: 165
Re: Different backpack strap mounting options
« Reply #6 on: August 26, 2016, 06:28:49 AM »
Thanks for the great replies!

I couldn't agree more about the fabric tearing when the straps are sewn directly, I forgot about this but I've seen so many packs fail like that... Personally I always cut the foam shorter, it's a pain to sew 1cm thick (or more) foam when there are already several layers from the backpanel and side walls, webbing etc. especially when it comes to bind the inside!

I guess I'm starting to sew the strap with webbing in-between from now on, maybe the camelbak way (webbing on both sides of the strap) to hide the crappy strap end closure ^^ And regarding the small packs where I'd sew directly in the back seam, maybe add some webbing/binding on the sides to prevent the fabric from tearing.

A curvature of the backpanel would be a nice touch, I should try that someday.

Off topic: Bootcat I see you mentioned PEHD, I got some but it's rolled, do you got any tricks to flatten it so it doesn't bend inside the pack?
« Last Edit: August 26, 2016, 06:33:27 AM by Fouinard »

Bootcat

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 182
    • View Profile
    • Tiger Tailor
  • Liked: 21
  • Likes Given: 24
Re: Different backpack strap mounting options
« Reply #7 on: August 26, 2016, 06:44:52 AM »
The classic way is to sew a 1,5" wide webbing pouch on the vertical axis and insert an aluminium flat bar. Only it's a pain to find 6061 alu bars around here...
I would unroll, lay flat in the summer sun, weight with something and come back a few hours later. When the pack has the correct curves the PEHD doesn't bend much.
And last, you should use 1,5mm, less is not good, more is too heavy and still flexible unless you cut holes in the structure.

Fouinard

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 172
  • Forum creeper
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 90
  • Likes Given: 165
Re: Different backpack strap mounting options
« Reply #8 on: August 26, 2016, 06:49:02 AM »
Right, I did the 1.5" web + alu bar a few times :) What's with the 6061 aluminium? I usually buy some 1 mm aluminium section at leroy merlin, this one isn't good for this application?
I just thought of unrolling it under the sun just after posting the message but didn't know if it would actually work.
I got 1 mm which is a bit thin like you said and 2 mm which is too thick ^^

essal

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 511
    • View Profile
    • Nora Tactical
  • Liked: 85
  • Likes Given: 45
Re: Different backpack strap mounting options
« Reply #9 on: August 26, 2016, 09:42:30 AM »
A lot of HDPEs have memory, so unrolling and placing a load on it might straighten it out. It will also shape to the wearers body after some time, I used to flip the one in my ATS RAID every now and then because of this.
Nora Tactical
Product Technician - Norrøna

Bootcat

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 182
    • View Profile
    • Tiger Tailor
  • Liked: 21
  • Likes Given: 24
Re: Different backpack strap mounting options
« Reply #10 on: August 26, 2016, 11:05:38 AM »
Plain vanilla aluminium is too easy to bend.

TwoWayTrauma

  • Chuck - Maker
  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 436
    • View Profile
    • Two Way Trauma
  • Liked: 60
  • Likes Given: 76
Re: Different backpack strap mounting options
« Reply #11 on: August 26, 2016, 03:00:58 PM »
I learned this technique from CDHTac a while ago. It's been working out pretty well for me.  On my next pack, I will probably use a similar technique, but mount them a few inches down on the back, so the pack sits higher.



Chuck
Two Way Trauma: Providing equipment for those trained in the judicious application and relief of trauma.

www.TwoWayTrauma.com
www.facebook.com/twowaytrauma
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UChS-9_c8LCydZlDMYVWLxWA

@less@ndro

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 155
    • View Profile
    • ChioccioLab
  • Liked: 70
  • Likes Given: 119
Re: Different backpack strap mounting options
« Reply #12 on: August 27, 2016, 11:01:21 AM »
i want really try another technique that i saw in a camelback backpack that i have. there is a 2" or 1.5" Dring attached to the top of the pack with webbing and the shoulder straps is attached to the Dring with a 1" webbing. in this way you don't have to play with the angle of the shoulder straps and it does the regulation alone.

cdhtac

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 100
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 46
  • Likes Given: 7
Re: Different backpack strap mounting options
« Reply #13 on: September 05, 2016, 07:52:14 AM »
I have two methods for attaching the straps;

The first one is for small packs, described by TwoWayTrauma on his post.. It´s a nice and simple method, which keeps the layer buildup in the seam into a minimum, and also kind of puts the straps automatically into a natural angle.

The second method is for medium and large packs;

2" webbing is box-x`d into both shoulder straps, which in turn, atre box-x´d into the backpanel. Also notice the box-x (well, more like a diamond-x) which is sewn through both straps. (on the other side of the backpanel, i have hotglued an extra layer of 1000d for extra strength. After the box-x´s, i cut the excess of that fabric away)

The great thing about this method is that it allows the use of load lifters (which i think is an absolute must when making anything bigger than a small pack), and also the straps have some space to move, so they will adapt to the body of the user

Hope this helps






Misadventure Gear

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 71
    • View Profile
  • Liked: 14
  • Likes Given: 27
Re: Different backpack strap mounting options
« Reply #14 on: September 05, 2016, 03:44:30 PM »
I've made a few that are similar to the webbing V method CDHTac showed. That method can be easily adapted to mount on a webbing and Velcro ladder system to allow vertical adjustment of the shoulder straps.... Think PALS for pack straps.